32:33 Nia: As we start to wrap up our conversation, I want to talk about something that feels really important—the healing process itself. Because understanding your attachment style is one thing, but actually changing these deep patterns that have been with you since childhood? That seems like it would be a whole different level of challenge.
32:53 Jackson: You're absolutely right, and I think it's important to be honest about this. Healing attachment wounds isn't like flipping a switch. These patterns were formed over years, sometimes decades, and they served important survival functions. So changing them requires patience, compassion, and often a lot of support.
8:48 Nia: That makes sense. I imagine people might feel discouraged when they recognize their patterns but find themselves still falling into them.
33:18 Jackson: That's so normal! And it's actually part of the process. Awareness comes first, then you start catching yourself in the middle of the pattern, then maybe you catch yourself before you act on it. It's a gradual progression, not an instant transformation.
33:32 Nia: So it's more like learning a new language than having surgery?
29:21 Jackson: That's a perfect analogy! You're literally learning a new language of intimacy and connection. And just like learning any new language, you're going to make mistakes, feel awkward, and sometimes revert to your native tongue when you're stressed.
33:47 Nia: What role does self-compassion play in this healing process?
33:50 Jackson: It's absolutely crucial! One of the biggest obstacles to healing is the shame and self-criticism that often comes with recognizing our patterns. People think, "I'm so messed up" or "I'll never be able to have a healthy relationship."
34:03 Nia: And that shame probably makes it even harder to change?
0:41 Jackson: Exactly! Shame keeps us stuck because it activates our threat detection system. When we're in shame, we're not in a learning mindset—we're in survival mode. Self-compassion, on the other hand, creates the emotional safety needed for growth and change.
34:19 Nia: So how do you develop self-compassion when you're used to being self-critical?
34:23 Jackson: It starts with recognizing that your attachment patterns developed for good reasons. That anxious attachment? It helped you stay connected to an inconsistent caregiver. That avoidant attachment? It protected you from further emotional injury. These were intelligent adaptations.
34:38 Nia: So instead of seeing them as flaws, you see them as survival strategies that served their purpose?
0:41 Jackson: Exactly! And then you can start asking, "What do I need now? How can I honor the part of me that developed these strategies while also creating space for new ways of being?"
34:52 Nia: This makes me think about the role of community and relationships in healing. Can we really heal attachment wounds in isolation?
34:59 Jackson: That's such an insightful question! And the research is pretty clear—we heal in relationship. Our attachment wounds were created in relationship, and they're healed in relationship too. This is why therapy can be so powerful—it provides a corrective emotional experience.
35:14 Nia: So we need other people to help us learn new ways of connecting?
9:53 Jackson: Absolutely! But it doesn't have to be a romantic relationship. It could be a friendship, a therapeutic relationship, a support group, or even a relationship with a mentor or coach. The key is finding people who can provide consistent, reliable, attuned connection.
35:31 Nia: What about people who feel like they don't have access to those kinds of relationships right now?
35:35 Jackson: That's a real challenge, and I don't want to minimize it. But there are still things you can do. Reading books about attachment, joining online communities, practicing self-compassion, working with a therapist—all of these can be steps toward healing.
35:48 Nia: And I imagine the relationship with yourself is foundational too?
9:53 Jackson: Absolutely! Learning to be curious about your inner experience instead of critical, learning to comfort yourself when you're distressed, learning to celebrate your growth—these are all ways of providing yourself with secure attachment.
36:03 Nia: What about setbacks? I imagine the healing process isn't linear.
5:40 Jackson: Not at all! Setbacks are completely normal and expected. You might have a period where you feel like you're making progress, and then something stressful happens and you find yourself right back in your old patterns.
36:17 Nia: That must be so frustrating.
36:19 Jackson: It can be! But here's what I want people to understand—setbacks aren't failures. They're information. They tell you where you still have tender spots that need attention. And often, you'll notice that even when you "relapse" into old patterns, you recover more quickly than before.
36:33 Nia: So you're building resilience even when it doesn't feel like it?
0:41 Jackson: Exactly! And over time, the setbacks become less frequent and less intense. You develop what researchers call a "secure functioning" relationship with yourself and others.
20:17 Nia: What does that look like day-to-day?
36:46 Jackson: It looks like being able to express your needs without feeling selfish, being able to comfort yourself when you're upset, being able to stay present during conflict, being able to trust that relationships can weather storms. It's not about being perfect—it's about being resilient.
37:00 Nia: And I imagine it affects all areas of life, not just romantic relationships?
9:53 Jackson: Absolutely! When you develop secure attachment, it influences how you show up at work, how you parent your children, how you navigate friendships, how you handle stress. It's like upgrading your operating system for relationships.
37:16 Nia: That sounds like it would have a ripple effect on future generations too.
37:19 Jackson: That's one of the most hopeful aspects of this work! When you heal your own attachment wounds, you're not just changing your life—you're changing the trajectory for your children and their children. You're breaking cycles that may have been going on for generations.
37:31 Nia: So the work you do on yourself is actually a gift to everyone around you?
32:19 Jackson: Beautifully said! And I think that's such an important reframe. Sometimes people feel selfish for focusing on their own healing, but the truth is, the more secure and whole you become, the more you have to offer others.
37:45 Nia: As we wrap up, what would you want someone to remember if they recognize themselves in these attachment patterns and feel overwhelmed by the idea of changing them?
37:53 Jackson: I would want them to know that they're not broken, they're not too much, and they're not doomed to repeat these patterns forever. The fact that they're aware enough to recognize their patterns means they're already on the path to healing. And every small step matters—every moment of self-compassion, every boundary they set, every time they choose vulnerability over self-protection. It all adds up to profound transformation over time.
38:14 Nia: And that this awareness and healing can literally change how exhausting relationships feel?
9:53 Jackson: Absolutely! When you understand your attachment patterns and start healing them, relationships become less about survival and more about genuine connection and growth. The exhaustion that comes from constantly trying to manage your anxiety or protect yourself from intimacy—that starts to lift. You begin to experience the joy and energy that comes from secure, authentic relationships.
38:39 Nia: Thank you so much for this incredible conversation, Jackson. I feel like we've covered so much ground, and I know our listeners are going to find this incredibly valuable. To everyone who's been listening today, we'd love to hear from you. What resonated with you? What questions came up? You can reach us through our website, and we always appreciate your feedback and suggestions for future episodes. Thanks for joining us on this exploration of attachment, boundaries, and the path to more fulfilling relationships. Until next time, take care of yourselves and each other.